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The Argument Clinic

Doppleganger posting in The Argument Clinic
User: argument_clinic (posted by evilgrins)
Date: August 20th, 2008
Subject: maybe I'm not supposed to understand these things
Security: Public
Location:94306
Mood:Hic!Hic!
Media:The Mask of Zorro
Tags:news of the weird
xposted to Crazy AmericansPower·to·the·People, I'm right and you're wrongThe·Argument·Clinic, & WeirdfolksWeirdfolks

11:25 PM 8/18/08 · According to the top universities across the United States...binge drinking, alcoholic poisoning, and just the general consumption of alcohol is way out of control and far too common these days. The news tonight (Monday) reported that 100 universities across the nation have come to a united stance regarding this and how to best deal with the situation.

They want to reduce the legal drinking age to 18 years of age.

This makes absolutely no sense. Only thing that will likely result from this is that there will be even more of these problems than there are now.

Oddly the 2nd most popular idea was to raise the taxes on alcohol, which apparently have been at the same level the last 16 years. However, this particular idea is not as popular as the one I presented at the beginning of this.

WTF?!
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Pretty eyes, pirate smile: Charlotte
User: prokrstn8r
Date: August 20th, 2008 (UTC)
Subject: (no subject)
Keyword:Charlotte
I am absolutely in favor of lowering the drinking age to 18. Do you konw how unbelievably frustrating it is to live on my own, be able to die in war, but not be able to marinate brats?

Also, in making it illegal, you create a shorter supply, which makes something more desirable.

The United States is one of hte most alcohol-obsessed countries in the world, and it's no coincidence that we have the highest drinking age. If it were not such a big deal, people would abuse it less. Making it illegal, and makign the legal age so ridiculously high just makes people want to ABUSE it more.
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Doppleganger
User: evilgrins
Date: August 20th, 2008 (UTC)
Subject: (no subject)
Also, in making it illegal, you create a shorter supply, which makes something more desirable
Clearly given the number of kids, 18 and much youner, that are constantly seeking alcohol already and getting plastered all over the place.

An interesting thing was that this newscaster has the opportunity to interview people in Holland about this, who have a much younger drinking age. They think we should make it harder to access alcohol.
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Doppleganger: feeling sickie-poo
User: evilgrins
Date: August 20th, 2008 (UTC)
Subject: (no subject)
Keyword:feeling sickie-poo
Also, it's not the age restriction that makes kids abuse it...it's the effect it has on them. They just wanna get drunk.
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Pretty eyes, pirate smile
User: prokrstn8r
Date: August 20th, 2008 (UTC)
Subject: (no subject)
*shakes head*

It's without question the restriction that makes kids ABUSE it. If it were legal and commonplace, they'd USE it, not ABUSE it.
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Doppleganger
User: evilgrins
Date: August 20th, 2008 (UTC)
Subject: (no subject)
I'd find that easier to believe were it not for the fact that those it is legal to drink abuse it just as much if not more. To simply say it's the restriction that causes this flies in the face of that.
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Pretty eyes, pirate smile
User: prokrstn8r
Date: August 20th, 2008 (UTC)
Subject: (no subject)
That's partially due to the fact that they couldn't get it for so long, so when they are finally able, they go crazy. If there were more of a natural progression, or less of an emphasis/obsession with the damned stuff, people wouldn't go crazy when they turn 21. That is the point. That is what people are primarily trying to stop by lowering the drinking age.

And the law, as it stands, is all screwy. It absolutely does not make any sense that a person is considered a legal adult in all regards except the ability to drink. There is no medical evidence supporting benefits from preventing 18, 19, and 20 year olds from drinking.

And you can't tell me that Americans are just somehow GENETICALLY PREDISPOSED to magically abusing alcohol in their 20's. The only difference between the US and countries whose drinking age is 18, 19, or 20, is that there is a more relaxed attitude about alochol, and it is abused less.
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Doppleganger
User: evilgrins
Date: August 20th, 2008 (UTC)
Subject: (no subject)
so when they are finally able, they go crazy
thus bringing it down to 18 means that those younger than that will go crazy. No, wait, they already do by raiding their parents liquor cabinets. Holding prescription parties. Etc.

can't tell me that Americans are just somehow GENETICALLY PREDISPOSED to magically abusing alcohol in their 20's
Nope, you're right. I'd say humans worldwide are though.

Don't know that it is abused less really outside our borders. I've been out of the country more than a few times, as have friends o' mine, and the abuse is fairly apparant all over.
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Pretty eyes, pirate smile
User: prokrstn8r
Date: August 20th, 2008 (UTC)
Subject: (no subject)
regardless, the law is inconsistent and wrong. Just because it's in place now, doesn't make it right.

Explain to me how someone is old enough to die in the Army, but not yet old enough to buy cooking sherry. Seriously.
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Doppleganger
User: evilgrins
Date: August 20th, 2008 (UTC)
Subject: (no subject)
I'm not sure using a cooking liquid, alcoholic or not, is entirely in context...and I can't. Though, i'm not in favor of either really, so far as alcoholic consumption goes.

All said and done, alcohol is addictive and I think it should be banned because of it. Not like before either, I mean effectively. It may not be practical, it may not be feasible...but we'd all be the better for it.
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Pretty eyes, pirate smile
User: prokrstn8r
Date: August 20th, 2008 (UTC)
Subject: (no subject)
It is illegal for persons under 21 to buy or posess, for that matter, any alcoholic beverage...including ones to cook with. No beer batters, no cooking sherry, no red wine in the spaghetti sauce, no brandy sauce on the apple pie. And that is ridiculous.

And the thing is, you can't just spout off an ideal...you have to put it into context. You are for the banning of all addictive substnaces. Well if that were to really occur, you KNOW it would be disastrous (and ineffective) in real life. So instead of continuing to spout off how much you are in favor of banning said substances, why don't you develop a stance that actually makes sense in the real world?
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Doppleganger: Kill de bastards
User: evilgrins
Date: August 20th, 2008 (UTC)
Subject: All, no.
Keyword:Kill de bastards
Alcohol, yes. Cigarettes, yes. Chocolate...I vill keel anyone that keeps me from it!!

Actually, it might make it more realistic if instead of complicating the issues so much, people tried chemically altering them so the addictive properties were removed.
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Pretty eyes, pirate smile
User: prokrstn8r
Date: August 20th, 2008 (UTC)
Subject: Re: All, no.
You do realize that for the majority of addictions, it's more mental than physical.

That's why people relapse and are not always automatically cured after they go through detox.

Taking away the physical shakes will not make a person stop WANTING to drink to escape from their problems, or stop the HABIT of drinking every night.

And, btw, if you want to talk statistics, heart disease is the #1 cause of death in this country...meaning that bad foods (like chocolate) kill way more people than alcohol does.
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Doppleganger
User: evilgrins
Date: August 22nd, 2008 (UTC)
Subject: Re: All, no.
more mental than physical
true with some things, less so with others. cigs and alcohol chemically bond with the body. alcohol stores itself in the fatty cells, hence the old beer gut thang, and actually kicks in serious cravings. cigs are laced with various toxins that in their minute qualities are just addictive and slowly damaging.

my chocolate addiction is entirely in my head. sure, it may kill me...but I'll die happy.
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Pretty eyes, pirate smile
User: prokrstn8r
Date: August 22nd, 2008 (UTC)
Subject: Re: All, no.
Actually you're wrong about a lot of that.

YES cigarettes and alcohol (and cocaine, etc) DO have physical addictive properties. However, even beyond that, the user is usually IN THE HABIT of doing said activity.

This is why so many people who have gone through a chemical detox relapse.

It's like those commercials that show people struggling to drive or get ready or drink coffee, and the announcer comes on and says "if you can re-learn how to get dressed without a cigarette, you can re-learn how to do anything without one."

Beyond all the physical addictions are the mental and behavioral addictions.

Also, yo'ure wrong that chocolate is not chemically addicting. You get the exact same reward (seratonin) from eating chocolate as cocaine users do (though to a smaller degree - which may be why you eat so much of it).

Also, you'd be extremely hard-pressed to find a chocolate that is NOT made with white refined sugar. White refined sugar is OFFICIALLY classified as "an addictive substance" alongside nicotine and caffeine.

Incidentally, chocolate also naturally contains caffeine.
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Doppleganger
User: evilgrins
Date: August 22nd, 2008 (UTC)
Subject: Re: All, no.
chocolate also naturally contains caffeine
I know...
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KitWench
User: kitwench
Date: August 20th, 2008 (UTC)
Subject: (no subject)
Seriously, how can any national policy be as out of touch with human nature and basic common sense as our high minded snobbery of the 21 yo drinking age ?
It's basic human nature to resent being belittled. When we claim to bestow all of the responsibilities of adulthood upon 18 yo's , we insult their intelligence when we withhold the likewise privileges of adulthood.
It's basic human nature to be more attracted to that which is forbidden - and most especially that which only forbidden be some 'magic number' of an artificial age constraint.
European nations have nowhere near our troubles with young adults and alcohol because they don't bother to elevate a simple drink to the importance with which we self centered controlling Americans do.
Dropping the drinking age back down to the age of adulthood will take away the excitement and cachet with which our college bound young men and women currently regard it.
They're adults. Let's playing the control game that's running our country into the ground.
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